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| IBM Haruna |
In this no holds-barred interview, Gen. Haruna lamented the gruesome murder of Gen. Muhammadu Shuwa, whom he described as his bosom friend and contemporary in the Army, insisting that the only way for his memory to be preserved is for the Federal Government to fish out his killers and bring them to justice. He also admonished those he said are still parochially clinging on to the concept of North as a political entity to wake up to the reality that it is long dead as a political grouping. He speaks more on sundry issues with the ASSISTANT EDITOR, LINUS OBOGO. Excerpts:
ONE of Nigeria’s war veterans, Gen. Muhammed Shuwa, who staked his life for the unity of Nigeria, was last week killed in cold blood by unknown gunmen in his house. How did the news of his death come to you, at a time peace is about to be negotiated between the government and the Islamic fundamental sect, Boko Haram?
It was rather unfortunate. The late Muhammed Shuwa was my bosom friend and a contemporary in the Nigerian Army. We were cadets at the Ghana officer cadet school in 1958. Since then we remained friends and colleagues and served gallantly in the Nigerian Army as well as during the civil war. It was the most shocking and painful revelation to hear that he died in the manner the papers had reported. I feel very aggrieved and I wonder how this kind of death could come to a civil war veteran officer from unknown persons and they are not fished out and dealt with. It is the greatest shame of a nation.
The one thing the Federal Government can do for his memory is to uncover the characters behind the act. And it is also the only way the government can reassure those of us who staked our lives and fought for the unity of Nigeria. I pray for his soul to rest in peace. Death will come to all of us. It is just the manner it comes that makes it the more worrisome.
With the Boko Haram denying complicity in the death of Gen. Shuwa, where does this leave the government in tracking down those behind the killing and does this in anyway suggest the existence of a group other than Boko Haram?
There is really no room for speculation. A crime has been committed and it is the duty of the state and the security agencies to ensure that people who commit crimes do not get away with them. It was such a heinous crime committed in that kind of way and it must not be allowed to go unresolved. We cannot begin to speculate about where the responsibility lies. But we know definitely that there was a victim of an act of murder. It is such a shameful thing to have gone to kill an old man who had served this country with all his life.
As a nation-state, the responsibility lies with the various institutions of government to uncover a crime and bring the perpetrators to book. Even if we were living in an uncivilised, backward and barbaric state, it would not be possible that a stranger would just come into your living room and kill you without anyone knowing where the killer came from. But we are now in a community of people where people must not be allowed to terminate others’ lives. And this is where the government has a responsibility to ensure that society does not degenerate to a state of lawlessness and criminality.
A lot of Nigerians have been forced to conclude that given the manner the lives of citizens are being snuffed out as if we were in a war situation, the government appears helpless and has not done enough to tackle insecurity and stem the orgy of violence in the country, particularly in the North. What’s your comment on this?
Security has always been a serious challenge, even to the most organised and sophisticated country in the world. Insecurity can manifest itself in any manner of ways. Do not forget that as sophisticated as America was, President JF Kennedy was killed. Yet it is the most powerful and the most organised nation in the world.
So, the proof of maturity and responsibility of a nation is being able to withstand the threat to the security of lives and property of its people as well as of the state. So, to demonstrate that we can indeed tackle this kind of challenge as a nation, we must respond not only because a very important life has been terminated, but because every life is sacred and every life is important and must be protected and every human being has the right to live. So, if there are some mad people around who do not appreciate the value of life and the right to life, they must be uncovered and brought to book. And if that means that they must be put in an asylum so that other people can enjoy the right to life, they can jolly well be put in an asylum. The issue of security is not that of the government alone. It is the duty of everyone to ensure security in the community that he or she lives.
As former Chairman of Arewa Consultative Forum, ACF, would you say the body has done enough in assisting the government by engaging the Boko Haram sect to cease fire?
I cannot pass judgment on a forum that is neither a state organisation nor an executive arm of government. It is a socio-cultural organisation and we cannot hold it accountable for the failings of the state or its institutions. So, the ACF should be left out of it. It is not a police force or the army. To begin to ask questions about the role of ACF is to look for a scapegoat. What about the political parties? Are they not the ones who form the government? Are they not the ones appointing people into offices? A socio-cultural organisation cannot take over the functions of government that has the governors, the police and ministers. The ACF is not a federal, state or local government.
Why will anybody want to blame the ineptitude of the state on Arewa, Ohanaeze Indigbo or the Afenifere? There are institutions and agencies of government meant to exercise the powers of investigation and suppression of crimes and lawlessness in the society. So, we should learn to situate responsibility squarely where it belongs. Leave ACF, Ohanaeze Indigbo and Afenifere out of it. If these organisations should become criminals tomorrow, will the state not deal with them accordingly if they decide to criminalise themselves? Will the state spare them simply because they are socio-cultural bodies? The state has a responsibility to fight them if their activities become inimical to the smooth running of the state. So, the same principle should be applied in the handling of Boko Haram.
The Boko Haram sect has finally agreed to dialogue with the government by going ahead to name those who to represent them in the proposed talks. How much faith do you have in the talks and those they have chosen and should government be negotiating with terrorist groups?
You are asking me a very difficult question, my friend. As a military man, I know that the initiative, militarily, should not be left to the adversary. What is happening now goes against the grain of my own thinking as a trained military officer. I can only situate the unfolding scenario within the realm of politics. But I am not a politician. However, whatever will bring peace deserves some test.
As to whether the Federal Government should enter into a dialogue with Boko Haram, I will say that the logic to finding a political solution to peace is in the realm of negotiation. And every negotiation has its objectives and merits. So, we cannot conclude that every terrorist group that may emerge should take the initiative to determine how it intends to bring about peace.
The government should devise various means of achieving solutions which can be negotiated. And if any means is acceptable to the parties in negotiation, what matters in the end is peace.
After All, we have adopted a regional development paradigm for the Niger Delta region. But the solutions may not go on forever because it is a political and not a constitutional arrangement. However, peace among communities and people must be pursued through any means that security of lives and property is guaranteed. If the government comes up with a peace process that is not acceptable by the people, do you think that the conflict can be resolved? So, every conflict that comes to the forefront should be dealt with. And if it is like the Boko Haram challenge, it should be dealt with as well. After all, after every war and conflict, there is always some negotiation. Recall that after the First World War, there was some negotiation which brought about the League of Nations. And after the Second World War came the United Nations Organisation, which was also a product of negotiation. So, there are so many instances and precedents which could help in the establishment of structures for negotiation.
Some people are often quick to blame the menace of Boko Haram on poverty. Would you say it is poverty and if so, when did this poverty scourge begin and why is it imploding now that Dr. Goodluck Jonathan is in office as President?
Let me tell you something my dear brother. At the foundation of every conflict, there is a phenomenon called poverty. It could be poverty of the stomach, poverty of ideas, poverty of knowledge and poverty of trust. There is also poverty caused by alienation from civilised organisations.
So, underlining all the terrorist conflicts in the world, there is a feeling in the people of a lack of sense of belonging, not being a constituent of civilisation in a manner that it is perceived as inequitable. In a country like ours, from independence till date, we have been unable to resolve the issue of the wide and ever expanding gap between the haves and the haves-not in terms of not only wealth but also opportunity. The challenge of opportunity to climb the scale of economic and social ladder of the society, as well as opportunity to live long and be allowed to express your talent. So, these are all forms of poverty. That you cannot go to school, or that you cannot learn what will be useful to you and your society or that you are not allowed access to opportunities owing to discrimination, and you have no income because you are not employed and you are confronted with hunger, lack of access to basic healthcare. Given all these deprivations in a developing society, people are quick to resort to violence. They will turn to the consumption of psychotropic substances like Indian hemp and other vegetables and in turn refuse to imbibe the Ten Commandments. They will begin to see the non-existing lines in different religions and forget the civilisation and beliefs that God has revealed to us over the years. The principles of God also encourage us to uplift the low, the needy and the downtrodden and the poor. This is where government has a responsibility to provide some form of reliefs to those at the lower rungs of the ladder.
So, buffeted by all these, is what people will like to call poverty. Of course, poverty in inverted commas. It is in inverted commas because you have to examine the content of this poverty and what is in it that makes people poor.
Are you aware that there was violence in 1966 in the South West? And there was also violence by the military in 1983, which led to the overthrow of President Shehu Shagari and after that, the military continued to overturn itself. This was all violence manifested in various ways. What is happening today is not because of President Jonathan or whether it is directed at a certain region of the country. What we are witnessing today is not new. It is just because it is now being carried out by the very poor people whose identity cannot be ascertained or what their organisations are that is why people are saying it is poverty. The common factor is that there have been various forms of revolt. The revolt has not been against one particular government as against the other. It is a revolt against the lack of organisations and structures within the Nigerian state at various levels.
You will recall that when the colonial overlords were ruling, it was not as if we were any better, richer or poorer than we are today, but the fact is that they were organised. That was why they were able to harness our raw materials like groundnut, cotton, cocoa for their factories in the UK. They were very organised in exploiting our economy. So, essentially, it is all about economic and social organisation. We have had different development plans without realising their goals, whether it was Operation Feed the Nation or the Green Revolution. And what happened to leaders who enunciated these development plans? Nothing! But they approved monies and disappeared with them.
All the various revolts- military, Boko Haram, MEND, OPC, MASSOB etc, are culminations of frustrations built overtime. Why people choose to die is because there is nothing for them to look forward to and so they do not care about the value for life. But if they know there is good reason to be alive, they will not accept to be used as suicide bombers to strap improvised explosive devices on themselves. They will have good reason to want to be alive and enjoy the value of being alive.
Having witnessed various governments since Nigeria’s Independence, with the benefit of hindsight, how will you score each successive regime from 1960 till date?
Honestly, my brother, there is no standard by which you can score any regime that has ruled this country since Independence. There is absolutely no standard. All regimes have been adjudged to be corrupt. Right from Major Kaduna Nzeogwu’s attempted revolution to other rebellions, all the regimes have been more than corrupt. How do I score the various regimes when the very institutions that should make governance accountable to the people are themselves more corrupt? These same corrupt institutions are enjoying robust headlines in the media. The judiciary has equally written itself into Nigeria’s corruption folklore.
When property and money are confiscated from those accused of corruption, there is no account of the forfeiture and in the end, you do not know who are the beneficiaries of the seizures. So, what are we talking about? Please do not ask me to score or assess any government when there is no standard. Are you asking me to assess our development against those of Hon Kong, Singapore, China, Malaysia, Brazil or the US? Will you in all sincerity say that we are a developing democracy or developing economy when there is no confidence in our investment market?
When you turn to religion, there are a few religious leaders who are working for the salvation of mankind. But again, there many more religious leaders whose main preoccupation is to make money. While they are busy making money from their flock, the same flock is wallowing in abject poverty and want. The pastors continue to ask money from their congregation so that their faith can be strengthened.
There must be standard and the standard is the rule of law and the equality before the law. We must ask ourselves, what is our perception of leadership and duty? Is it to ourselves as individuals or to the citizens? Is the leadership motivated by duty and responsibility to its subjects or is it attracted by the sweet aroma of oil wealth? The gospel truth is that we are suffering from inept and maladjusted leadership, leadership that is neck-deep in stealing.
The former governor of the old Kaduna State, Alhaji Muhammadu Lawal Kaita, was recently quoted as saying that the North no longer has a leader, so sad that nobody is today respected enough to command leadership. Do you share his sentiment and if yes, how did the region arrive at this dissonance?
My simple answer is that in the North, we are living in huge contradiction. And we have always been in this contradiction. Why can’t people take this kind of statement from Lawal Kaita with a pinch of salt?
Are we really organised as North and South? Is it lawful? For somebody to start classifying us as North and South is it right and lawful? That was a dishonest statement from Kaita because we are not North and South. It is a statement from people who continuously want us to remain divided. Some people are still living in the past to continue to hold on to such geographical deceit as the North. I know of the North, East, West, Mid-West, but not North and South. There are some people who want to be seen as the new Sardaunas, but unfortunately, we cannot have another Sardauna again and we cannot go back to Northern region any longer. It now belongs in the past to talk about a political leader from the North because we cannot have that arrangement again. Why do they want to see an individual promoted and celebrated as Sardauna? Is the North now an emirate?
People need to be educated to understand the context in which things are said and applied. The way you media report some of these things sometimes said by these people is not helpful. You guys need to educate them. We cannot continue in illiteracy, else, we will continue to cling on to our conscience on the basis of illiteracy. I do not have the concept of Northern leaders in my own worldview. So do not talk to me about Northern leaders. I only know of leaders in governance, bureaucracy and in the three tiers of government.
I also know that we have cultural leaders called Igwe or Obi, the Oba and the emir. They fall within the context of cultural leadership. They have their place in the society and they also have their limit. But outside that, I do not look at leadership within the context and parameters of tribe or the North, South, East. There was never a time we were socially organised as tribes. So, people are contextualising it so that they can exploit it. I do not share in the classification and I do not see the human person in this context. I see the human person as free to learn, free to move about, free to socialise and integrate with others and be responsible to God. I see people first as human beings, not on the basis of where he or she was born or what language he or she speaks.
Forty two years after the end of the Nigerian Civil war, a new controversy has emerged over the roles played by Gen. Yakubu Gowon (rtd) and the late Chief Obafemi Awolowo with accusations of genocide and the use of starvation as a weapon of war by Prof. Chinua Achebe, against the Igbo in his memoir, There was a Country. What’s your perspective to the controversy as a participant in the 30 months civil war?
Controversies are human creations. Having said that, I must add that there are certain things in history that you cannot controvert if you accept the facts. It is either Prof. Achebe is twisting the facts or he is interpreting the context to serve his own purpose. But this is an unwarranted controversy because the facts are there for all to see. Will he deny that there were killings in the North, which culminated in counter-killings? Or is Achebe going to deny that there was a conflict of leadership and seniority between Gowon and Ojukwu? In what context is he perpetuating the view of genocide? Those who want to promote controversy should first of all state the facts. Above all, what were the objectives of the civil war? Was it to kill the Igbo? The war would not have come about until the county was divided into states. When people want to talk about the past, they should strive to put it in proper context.
Ahead of 2015, there are already agitations that the Presidency should move to the North, despite that it is within the law for the incumbency to aspire for a second term. Do you also subscribe to the presidency shifting to the North?
I have told you earlier that I do not uphold nor subscribe to the concept of North. This is a vocabulary that has since lost its meaning. It has no place in my vocabulary. If it is a political thinking or movement or the exercise of political right, I think we should leave them to their theory. But my outlook does not tally or coincide with others’ notion of the North. Mine is not consistent with somebody thinking of North or South. I do not see the leader of either my state or local government as one geographical entity or tribal person. I see him as being there to perform a function.
ONE of Nigeria’s war veterans, Gen. Muhammed Shuwa, who staked his life for the unity of Nigeria, was last week killed in cold blood by unknown gunmen in his house. How did the news of his death come to you, at a time peace is about to be negotiated between the government and the Islamic fundamental sect, Boko Haram?
It was rather unfortunate. The late Muhammed Shuwa was my bosom friend and a contemporary in the Nigerian Army. We were cadets at the Ghana officer cadet school in 1958. Since then we remained friends and colleagues and served gallantly in the Nigerian Army as well as during the civil war. It was the most shocking and painful revelation to hear that he died in the manner the papers had reported. I feel very aggrieved and I wonder how this kind of death could come to a civil war veteran officer from unknown persons and they are not fished out and dealt with. It is the greatest shame of a nation.
The one thing the Federal Government can do for his memory is to uncover the characters behind the act. And it is also the only way the government can reassure those of us who staked our lives and fought for the unity of Nigeria. I pray for his soul to rest in peace. Death will come to all of us. It is just the manner it comes that makes it the more worrisome.
With the Boko Haram denying complicity in the death of Gen. Shuwa, where does this leave the government in tracking down those behind the killing and does this in anyway suggest the existence of a group other than Boko Haram?
There is really no room for speculation. A crime has been committed and it is the duty of the state and the security agencies to ensure that people who commit crimes do not get away with them. It was such a heinous crime committed in that kind of way and it must not be allowed to go unresolved. We cannot begin to speculate about where the responsibility lies. But we know definitely that there was a victim of an act of murder. It is such a shameful thing to have gone to kill an old man who had served this country with all his life.
As a nation-state, the responsibility lies with the various institutions of government to uncover a crime and bring the perpetrators to book. Even if we were living in an uncivilised, backward and barbaric state, it would not be possible that a stranger would just come into your living room and kill you without anyone knowing where the killer came from. But we are now in a community of people where people must not be allowed to terminate others’ lives. And this is where the government has a responsibility to ensure that society does not degenerate to a state of lawlessness and criminality.
A lot of Nigerians have been forced to conclude that given the manner the lives of citizens are being snuffed out as if we were in a war situation, the government appears helpless and has not done enough to tackle insecurity and stem the orgy of violence in the country, particularly in the North. What’s your comment on this?
Security has always been a serious challenge, even to the most organised and sophisticated country in the world. Insecurity can manifest itself in any manner of ways. Do not forget that as sophisticated as America was, President JF Kennedy was killed. Yet it is the most powerful and the most organised nation in the world.
So, the proof of maturity and responsibility of a nation is being able to withstand the threat to the security of lives and property of its people as well as of the state. So, to demonstrate that we can indeed tackle this kind of challenge as a nation, we must respond not only because a very important life has been terminated, but because every life is sacred and every life is important and must be protected and every human being has the right to live. So, if there are some mad people around who do not appreciate the value of life and the right to life, they must be uncovered and brought to book. And if that means that they must be put in an asylum so that other people can enjoy the right to life, they can jolly well be put in an asylum. The issue of security is not that of the government alone. It is the duty of everyone to ensure security in the community that he or she lives.
As former Chairman of Arewa Consultative Forum, ACF, would you say the body has done enough in assisting the government by engaging the Boko Haram sect to cease fire?
I cannot pass judgment on a forum that is neither a state organisation nor an executive arm of government. It is a socio-cultural organisation and we cannot hold it accountable for the failings of the state or its institutions. So, the ACF should be left out of it. It is not a police force or the army. To begin to ask questions about the role of ACF is to look for a scapegoat. What about the political parties? Are they not the ones who form the government? Are they not the ones appointing people into offices? A socio-cultural organisation cannot take over the functions of government that has the governors, the police and ministers. The ACF is not a federal, state or local government.
Why will anybody want to blame the ineptitude of the state on Arewa, Ohanaeze Indigbo or the Afenifere? There are institutions and agencies of government meant to exercise the powers of investigation and suppression of crimes and lawlessness in the society. So, we should learn to situate responsibility squarely where it belongs. Leave ACF, Ohanaeze Indigbo and Afenifere out of it. If these organisations should become criminals tomorrow, will the state not deal with them accordingly if they decide to criminalise themselves? Will the state spare them simply because they are socio-cultural bodies? The state has a responsibility to fight them if their activities become inimical to the smooth running of the state. So, the same principle should be applied in the handling of Boko Haram.
The Boko Haram sect has finally agreed to dialogue with the government by going ahead to name those who to represent them in the proposed talks. How much faith do you have in the talks and those they have chosen and should government be negotiating with terrorist groups?
You are asking me a very difficult question, my friend. As a military man, I know that the initiative, militarily, should not be left to the adversary. What is happening now goes against the grain of my own thinking as a trained military officer. I can only situate the unfolding scenario within the realm of politics. But I am not a politician. However, whatever will bring peace deserves some test.
As to whether the Federal Government should enter into a dialogue with Boko Haram, I will say that the logic to finding a political solution to peace is in the realm of negotiation. And every negotiation has its objectives and merits. So, we cannot conclude that every terrorist group that may emerge should take the initiative to determine how it intends to bring about peace.
The government should devise various means of achieving solutions which can be negotiated. And if any means is acceptable to the parties in negotiation, what matters in the end is peace.
After All, we have adopted a regional development paradigm for the Niger Delta region. But the solutions may not go on forever because it is a political and not a constitutional arrangement. However, peace among communities and people must be pursued through any means that security of lives and property is guaranteed. If the government comes up with a peace process that is not acceptable by the people, do you think that the conflict can be resolved? So, every conflict that comes to the forefront should be dealt with. And if it is like the Boko Haram challenge, it should be dealt with as well. After all, after every war and conflict, there is always some negotiation. Recall that after the First World War, there was some negotiation which brought about the League of Nations. And after the Second World War came the United Nations Organisation, which was also a product of negotiation. So, there are so many instances and precedents which could help in the establishment of structures for negotiation.
Some people are often quick to blame the menace of Boko Haram on poverty. Would you say it is poverty and if so, when did this poverty scourge begin and why is it imploding now that Dr. Goodluck Jonathan is in office as President?
Let me tell you something my dear brother. At the foundation of every conflict, there is a phenomenon called poverty. It could be poverty of the stomach, poverty of ideas, poverty of knowledge and poverty of trust. There is also poverty caused by alienation from civilised organisations.
So, underlining all the terrorist conflicts in the world, there is a feeling in the people of a lack of sense of belonging, not being a constituent of civilisation in a manner that it is perceived as inequitable. In a country like ours, from independence till date, we have been unable to resolve the issue of the wide and ever expanding gap between the haves and the haves-not in terms of not only wealth but also opportunity. The challenge of opportunity to climb the scale of economic and social ladder of the society, as well as opportunity to live long and be allowed to express your talent. So, these are all forms of poverty. That you cannot go to school, or that you cannot learn what will be useful to you and your society or that you are not allowed access to opportunities owing to discrimination, and you have no income because you are not employed and you are confronted with hunger, lack of access to basic healthcare. Given all these deprivations in a developing society, people are quick to resort to violence. They will turn to the consumption of psychotropic substances like Indian hemp and other vegetables and in turn refuse to imbibe the Ten Commandments. They will begin to see the non-existing lines in different religions and forget the civilisation and beliefs that God has revealed to us over the years. The principles of God also encourage us to uplift the low, the needy and the downtrodden and the poor. This is where government has a responsibility to provide some form of reliefs to those at the lower rungs of the ladder.
So, buffeted by all these, is what people will like to call poverty. Of course, poverty in inverted commas. It is in inverted commas because you have to examine the content of this poverty and what is in it that makes people poor.
Are you aware that there was violence in 1966 in the South West? And there was also violence by the military in 1983, which led to the overthrow of President Shehu Shagari and after that, the military continued to overturn itself. This was all violence manifested in various ways. What is happening today is not because of President Jonathan or whether it is directed at a certain region of the country. What we are witnessing today is not new. It is just because it is now being carried out by the very poor people whose identity cannot be ascertained or what their organisations are that is why people are saying it is poverty. The common factor is that there have been various forms of revolt. The revolt has not been against one particular government as against the other. It is a revolt against the lack of organisations and structures within the Nigerian state at various levels.
You will recall that when the colonial overlords were ruling, it was not as if we were any better, richer or poorer than we are today, but the fact is that they were organised. That was why they were able to harness our raw materials like groundnut, cotton, cocoa for their factories in the UK. They were very organised in exploiting our economy. So, essentially, it is all about economic and social organisation. We have had different development plans without realising their goals, whether it was Operation Feed the Nation or the Green Revolution. And what happened to leaders who enunciated these development plans? Nothing! But they approved monies and disappeared with them.
All the various revolts- military, Boko Haram, MEND, OPC, MASSOB etc, are culminations of frustrations built overtime. Why people choose to die is because there is nothing for them to look forward to and so they do not care about the value for life. But if they know there is good reason to be alive, they will not accept to be used as suicide bombers to strap improvised explosive devices on themselves. They will have good reason to want to be alive and enjoy the value of being alive.
Having witnessed various governments since Nigeria’s Independence, with the benefit of hindsight, how will you score each successive regime from 1960 till date?
Honestly, my brother, there is no standard by which you can score any regime that has ruled this country since Independence. There is absolutely no standard. All regimes have been adjudged to be corrupt. Right from Major Kaduna Nzeogwu’s attempted revolution to other rebellions, all the regimes have been more than corrupt. How do I score the various regimes when the very institutions that should make governance accountable to the people are themselves more corrupt? These same corrupt institutions are enjoying robust headlines in the media. The judiciary has equally written itself into Nigeria’s corruption folklore.
When property and money are confiscated from those accused of corruption, there is no account of the forfeiture and in the end, you do not know who are the beneficiaries of the seizures. So, what are we talking about? Please do not ask me to score or assess any government when there is no standard. Are you asking me to assess our development against those of Hon Kong, Singapore, China, Malaysia, Brazil or the US? Will you in all sincerity say that we are a developing democracy or developing economy when there is no confidence in our investment market?
When you turn to religion, there are a few religious leaders who are working for the salvation of mankind. But again, there many more religious leaders whose main preoccupation is to make money. While they are busy making money from their flock, the same flock is wallowing in abject poverty and want. The pastors continue to ask money from their congregation so that their faith can be strengthened.
There must be standard and the standard is the rule of law and the equality before the law. We must ask ourselves, what is our perception of leadership and duty? Is it to ourselves as individuals or to the citizens? Is the leadership motivated by duty and responsibility to its subjects or is it attracted by the sweet aroma of oil wealth? The gospel truth is that we are suffering from inept and maladjusted leadership, leadership that is neck-deep in stealing.
The former governor of the old Kaduna State, Alhaji Muhammadu Lawal Kaita, was recently quoted as saying that the North no longer has a leader, so sad that nobody is today respected enough to command leadership. Do you share his sentiment and if yes, how did the region arrive at this dissonance?
My simple answer is that in the North, we are living in huge contradiction. And we have always been in this contradiction. Why can’t people take this kind of statement from Lawal Kaita with a pinch of salt?
Are we really organised as North and South? Is it lawful? For somebody to start classifying us as North and South is it right and lawful? That was a dishonest statement from Kaita because we are not North and South. It is a statement from people who continuously want us to remain divided. Some people are still living in the past to continue to hold on to such geographical deceit as the North. I know of the North, East, West, Mid-West, but not North and South. There are some people who want to be seen as the new Sardaunas, but unfortunately, we cannot have another Sardauna again and we cannot go back to Northern region any longer. It now belongs in the past to talk about a political leader from the North because we cannot have that arrangement again. Why do they want to see an individual promoted and celebrated as Sardauna? Is the North now an emirate?
People need to be educated to understand the context in which things are said and applied. The way you media report some of these things sometimes said by these people is not helpful. You guys need to educate them. We cannot continue in illiteracy, else, we will continue to cling on to our conscience on the basis of illiteracy. I do not have the concept of Northern leaders in my own worldview. So do not talk to me about Northern leaders. I only know of leaders in governance, bureaucracy and in the three tiers of government.
I also know that we have cultural leaders called Igwe or Obi, the Oba and the emir. They fall within the context of cultural leadership. They have their place in the society and they also have their limit. But outside that, I do not look at leadership within the context and parameters of tribe or the North, South, East. There was never a time we were socially organised as tribes. So, people are contextualising it so that they can exploit it. I do not share in the classification and I do not see the human person in this context. I see the human person as free to learn, free to move about, free to socialise and integrate with others and be responsible to God. I see people first as human beings, not on the basis of where he or she was born or what language he or she speaks.
Forty two years after the end of the Nigerian Civil war, a new controversy has emerged over the roles played by Gen. Yakubu Gowon (rtd) and the late Chief Obafemi Awolowo with accusations of genocide and the use of starvation as a weapon of war by Prof. Chinua Achebe, against the Igbo in his memoir, There was a Country. What’s your perspective to the controversy as a participant in the 30 months civil war?
Controversies are human creations. Having said that, I must add that there are certain things in history that you cannot controvert if you accept the facts. It is either Prof. Achebe is twisting the facts or he is interpreting the context to serve his own purpose. But this is an unwarranted controversy because the facts are there for all to see. Will he deny that there were killings in the North, which culminated in counter-killings? Or is Achebe going to deny that there was a conflict of leadership and seniority between Gowon and Ojukwu? In what context is he perpetuating the view of genocide? Those who want to promote controversy should first of all state the facts. Above all, what were the objectives of the civil war? Was it to kill the Igbo? The war would not have come about until the county was divided into states. When people want to talk about the past, they should strive to put it in proper context.
Ahead of 2015, there are already agitations that the Presidency should move to the North, despite that it is within the law for the incumbency to aspire for a second term. Do you also subscribe to the presidency shifting to the North?
I have told you earlier that I do not uphold nor subscribe to the concept of North. This is a vocabulary that has since lost its meaning. It has no place in my vocabulary. If it is a political thinking or movement or the exercise of political right, I think we should leave them to their theory. But my outlook does not tally or coincide with others’ notion of the North. Mine is not consistent with somebody thinking of North or South. I do not see the leader of either my state or local government as one geographical entity or tribal person. I see him as being there to perform a function.
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